The future of mortgage broking – an insider’s perspective

crystal
Creative Commons License photo credit: bb_matt
Today’s guest post comes from an anonymous senior industry executive (so anonymous, not even we know the true identity!).  Due to the controversial views expressed in this guest post, we will be heavily moderating comments, so please do remember our comment rules!  Enjoy.

Brokers are threatened by big bank dominance, however should they band together they’ll be in a stronger position to secure the longevity of the industry, writes a senior industry commentator.

With the market in such a state of flux it’s tough to call what next month will bring, let alone six to twelve months in to the future. Nevertheless I think you can draw some pretty firm conclusions on the future shape of our industry based on well founded assumptions about past behaviors.

Let me put my comments into context.  I have worked for major banks, non-bank lenders and mortgage managers over many years and I am still heavily involved in the mortgage and mortgage broking industry.

I’ve been on the asset and liability committees of major lenders where they debate mortgage pricing, margins and profitability.

I’ve led the mortgage business for lenders where I have been responsible for the market and financial performance of that product range.  I’ve also set the strategy and established the mortgage broker channel for a major non-bank lender.

Although I’ve never actually been a mortgage broker, as you can assume from the above, I’ve got solid industry pedigree. This experience has given me tremendous insights into the workings of our major lenders.

Looking into the future, I feel the following is going to play out and I’d be keen to see whether you have a similar take.

Firstly, I’ve made the very reasonable assumption that the primary goal of all truly commercial organisations is to make as much money as possible in the short-, medium- and longer-term.

For large public companies, like our banks, the share price is the boss - period.  Therefore maximising return equity, sustainable profitability and total shareholder return is of paramount importance.

I’m a big admirer of our banks, they are fantastic money making machines, and I’m a shareholder, but let’s not pretend they work for popularity points… it’s basis points they really care about.

I once asked David Murray, at the time the chief executive of the Commonwealth Bank, whether customers, staff or shareholders were the key stakeholders in his business.  Of course he give the standard answer about it being a balance between the three, customer and staff satisfaction were critical and this would lead to greater shareholder return etc….blah blah blah!

I didn’t believe him for one minute.

A senior executive at one bank once commented that the ‘perfect’ model for running a bank was to “piss your customers and staff off to the extent they don’t quite leave”.

If you give customers poorer service he reasoned, charge them higher rates and fees, give staff worse working conditions - with lower pay etc - then this would make your profits grow, as long as they don’t leave.

Make no mistake about it; banks are there to ruthlessly make money… and lots of it.

The conclusion: everything banks do can be traced back to making more money in some form (or self aggrandisement) - regardless of whatever PR spin they may apply.

The second major assumption is that the major banks have an oligopoly.  This means a great deal of market power concentrated in a few hands.

The Australian banks have this market power, with enormous combined market share in retail lending, deposits, insurance and wealth management, for example.

In the mortgage market in particular, this market power has increased dramatically in recent times. So what will the future hold?

Will banks kill the mortgage broker channel?

Let me say straight out that I believe that the major banks would rather the broker channel did not exist.

Banks have vast fortunes tied up in branch infrastructure and mobile lending teams, as well as other mortgage distribution channels - and they want to maximise the return on this investment.

What is the logic in banks supporting other channels that compete with their own? In the ‘golden days’, you went to the bank to get a loan, and that’s just the way they’d like it to be again.

Whether banks will continue to support the third-party channel depends on three related factors.   The first is economic, the second is risk, and the third is customer power.

Brokers offer an easy proposition for banks. They don’t have to employ you, don’t have to train you and don’t have to manage or support you very much. You are a marginal cost: banks largely pay for you only when they use you - i.e. you settle a loan and they pay you a commission.

Under their fixed cost model, banks have to pay for their branches and staff and mobile lenders regardless of business volumes.

It’s a simple economic equation.  If, all things being equal, banks can write a loan through mortgage brokers at the same or lower cost than through a branch or mobile lender, then that’s what they’ll do. However if mortgage brokers are more expensive for banks compared to other distribution channels, they won’t use you.  Remember, banks just want to make as much money as possible.

But of course, all things aren’t equal.

When it comes to risk, banks are very wary of brokers as they feel they have less control. When I set up the broker channel for a lender, the board was quite paranoid about ‘getting into bed’ with this dodgy mortgage broker crowd. Banks will demand a higher profit from the broker channel to compensate for this perceived higher risk.

Aside from the economic and risk factors, the other major factor determining the banks’ support of the broker channel is customer power. And for the past decade, the customer has had the upper hand.

With a multitude of mortgage products available from international banks, Australian major and regional banks, non-bank lenders, securitised lenders, mortgage managers, sub-prime lenders etc., competition has never been higher and customers have had excellent choice. Brokers offered customers a great value proposition and they needed you to help them though this maze of lenders and products.

With many customers turning to brokers, and many other products available, banks risked missing out on significant market share unless they provided their loans through brokers.

That’s now changed - big time. Banks continue to merge and buy competitors (the new Westpac/RAMS, CBA/BankWest groupings, for example) thereby reducing choice.

Securitised lenders, mortgage managers and sub-prime lenders have all but disappeared and non-bank lenders, foreign banks and regional banks have generally scaled back their lending.

The result: go to a broker these days and sure they’ll still give you a loan. You can have one from CBA, ANZ, NAB or Westpac!

And at the moment customers are pretty happy with that.  In uncertain times customers want a quality brand they trust (but still may not like). Why risk ending up with an expensive GE Money loan? As a mortgage customer, if I know there are only four credible suppliers and all their products are basically the same, why do I need a broker?

As a result, customer power (and therefore broker power) has greatly diminished. Today, it’s almost as if you get a loan from a major bank or you just don’t get a loan.

So what does the future hold considering the dominance of the big banks?

It used to be generally acknowledged that there was a significant first mover disadvantage among lenders in reducing broker commissions or exiting that channel altogether. The case is now not so clear. Brokers made a terrific fuss when Westpac first cut their broker commissions but most of you still give them plenty of business today.

So here are my predictions:

I would not be surprised to see one, or all of the major banks, cease using the broker channel altogether, at least in the short- to medium-term. Remember, they have already started this - unless you aggregate through certain groups or submit loans electronically, for example, some major lenders exclude you today.

I would not be surprised to see further broker commission cuts.  Why wouldn’t they?  They’ll make more money and customers can’t really easily go elsewhere for a loan in the current market.

Commission cuts may not come in the dramatic ‘slash and burn’ fashion of 2008 but if I were a bank I’d first of all muddy the water by making my commission arrangements more complex and less transparent and then gradually dial them down.  Sound familiar?

I would not be surprised to see banks starting to offer differential pricing or better value products through their own channels, rather than mortgage brokers.  Why not?

I would not be surprised to see banks having less restrictive credit criteria through their own channels, rather than mortgage brokers.  Why not?

I would not be surprised to see higher LVRs available through their own channels, rather than mortgage brokers.  Again, why not?

Will one bank go it alone down these paths?  That’s highly unlikely.  But when one moves it highly likely that the others will quickly follow, as they did when they cut broker commissions, moved interest rates or introduced new fees.

What can brokers do?
I honestly believe the power has shifted to the banks and today brokers are largely at their mercy.

But there are a number of things the industry and individual brokers can do.

As a broker, get serious about your business or get out of the industry - it’s as simple as that.  If you want to be a successful mortgage broker, be more professional, work harder at getting new business, service your customers better and work your back books harder.

Support other quality lenders and providers at every opportunity. Every loan or other product you submit to a major lender strengthens their hand and weakens yours. So do your utmost to support quality lenders outside the major banks.

Grow your mortgage offering and income with existing customers. If you are not at least offering to protect the mortgage with life insurance, for example, then the bank probably will.

If you are not offering home and contents insurance, the bank probably will. Build your mortgage customer’s loyalty to you, not to the bank you send them to.  More products from you will strengthen client loyalty.

Also consider diversification.  Some brokers are moving from being mortgage brokers to finance brokers, offering personal loans, commercial loans, leasing, car finance etc.

While a more difficult proposition than adding mortgage add on products such as insurance, it is achievable and can generate good revenue as a result.

There is an argument that mortgage brokers should become financial planners. Personally I don’t buy into that: it’s like dentists wanting to becoming doctors.
Mortgage brokers offer a strong service proposition to consumers; so do financial planners. It’s simply a different service.

For some brokers, consolidation may also be a sound strategy - there is strength in numbers. If you are an independent sole-trader mortgage broker with a small aggregator or franchise group, you are probably in a weaker position than being part of a larger group with a larger aggregator or franchise group.

Lastly, as an industry we need to continue to embrace further regulation and education.  It increases your credibility and helps weed out rogue elements.

As I sit here at my keyboard today, I don’t honestly know how the industry will look come six to twelve months time.  However I know the banks pretty well, I observe what’s going on in the market today and I fear the future will be as I’ve suggested above - but it does not need to be the reality.

Make no bones about it; it’s going to get tougher being a mortgage broker.  But it’s survivable.

78 Comments

Michael July 2, 2009

I share most of your forecasts but have little fear of the future. Smaller banks like ING offer better service and better rates than the big four, so I never use the big four unless I have to. With ING i never have to worry about channel conflict, them stealing loans or refinance. Their retention team is second to none and are protecting my ongoing commissions, no wonder they have a loan life double the big 4’s.
I have been saying ad nausium for years, if you are a broker and dealing exclusively withy the big four - get out of the industry, you are doing us all a diservice.

John July 2, 2009

Well no surprises there. Lazy brokers will continue to use the majors (and continue to whing about it). I for one do not. Educate yourselves to different lenders and use them. Apart from the DEF’s most non-bank lenders are ok when compared to the banks. It is just a matter of ’selling them’ to your clients. Cost of funds will drop and they will become even more competitive.

Jenny July 2, 2009

This is a very scary thought but a wake up to reality. I have a friend who is actually working on a website (mind you it is still under construction) that will give power to customers, staff and mortgage brokers to make known how bad (or good if they are) the banks actually are. It wont stop the fact that banks make millions (nothing will) but it will aid in showing the public what we go through and to understand. Its http://www.ratemybank.com.au

Louis July 2, 2009

This is so true and thank you for publishing it. I have been saying the same thing for 12 months when the banks cut commissions and provided different levels of service for their own branch network.

We can start supporting the non bank lenders but what GE Money has done makes me very cautious.

My advice is similar. Work hard now and eventually things will get back to the good old days. It’s the cycle.

TBONES July 2, 2009

“As a broker, get serious about your business or get out of the industry - it’s as simple as that. If you want to be a successful mortgage broker, be more professional, work harder at getting new business, service your customers better and work your back books harder.”

I couldn’t agree with this statement more! My clients regularly coment about how wonderful it is to have someone else do the work for them, without them even having to leave their home!! Convenience is the choice of today and that’s what we offer as Brokers (done correctly and in the clients best interest that is)!

Notwithstanding this, not every mortgagor qualifies with every Lender, as we all well know - and hence why i believe that we will always have a role to play - it’s just the level of remuneration that ‘greys’ the picture…

Richard Houston July 2, 2009

Yes the above is all true and that is why I got out of the mortgage broking industry. The Banks have used the Brokers to fill a void while they retooled their branch network to meet the customers demo’s etc. Then they started the shutdown process of delays, price differential, commission cuts and next will be fee to use their products. I tried to consolidate the brokers into a semi public company to give them more clout some years ago but they were all too busy and now the mortgage broking industry will suffer. Maybe the MFAA will save us…..or then again maybe Aussie John…..(now Aussie CBA)

KeyChange July 2, 2009

I feel like stage 9 of the softening up process just began. An anonymous post on such a big issue is hard to accept - for all we know it’s David Bell of the ABA….

Dan July 2, 2009

Could not have said it better myself. Agree 150% that the above concerns will come upon us all over the next 6-12 months

Broker 1 July 2, 2009

Great article, pretty much says what everyone thinks and maybe fears. I would not be surprised to see the days of a flat fee per settled application and no trail retutrn to the industry. This way the banks will retain the brokers who have large trail incomes, those who have small trails will be forced out. The majors do NOT care, this is shown in the way they treat their own staff. They are not even interested in their own customers, why would they care about a third party.

Steve July 2, 2009

I think the comments are bang on the mark. The big banks are clear winners over the last 12 months across both lending, insurances, wealth and deposits - and there is more and more pressure on international competitors in these sectors. They are capable of anything at this point.

Greg July 2, 2009

Firstly I don’t think you said anything that we haven’t been saying for a while now “Insider” “Executiv”.
I said months ago that the major lenders were looking to take away our market.
These days I tend to favor lenders that consider themselves more, a wholesaler, a bit like many fund managers in the financial planning industry. Wholesalers or product suppliers are more focused on continuing to supply us whereas the banks look to us for the customer and then lock the customers in through cross marketing and upselling.

Rest assured when lenders like CBA, NAB and Westpac are finished stiching up your clients with other services they couldn’t afford to leave anyway.

It is not unusual for me to meet with people who started out at say, CBA with just a home loan. Then within five years they have umpteen credit cards personal loans, insurance policies they cant pay, super funds that will only ever be used to repay debt and even then they will die in debt with reverse mortgages charged at 2 or 3 percent over prime.

Australians should be getting out of debt in their 30’s and 40’s. Unfortunately we are not doing so until our 50’s and 60’s. Far too late to create any meaningful retirement wealth (For most people).

Now before you all go off about great financial advice and how your clients own 25 properties and what a great adviser you might be, statistics show that the above comments relate to more than 60% of the population. So the anonymous executive is quite correct.

The mongrels have us exactly where they want us…. slave to the lender.

Phil July 2, 2009

I have been saying this to my aggregator now for months and keep being met with the reply that they have held talks with the major banks who have assured them that the third party channel is an integral part of their business. Maybe so, for now! Its time for the broking industry to wake up and start giving better support to the second tier lenders. Its also time for those second tier lenders to join forces in a massive advertising campaign to alert the unknowing public to the dangers facing the finance industry and the possibility that if they go unchecked we will soon only have a choice of four competitive financial institutions. The second tiers may have trouble competing on price alone however they can still offer something that the big 4 can’t - Service!

WHY? July 2, 2009

Why is the author of this article afraid to put his name up? He/She is only saying what everyone has been saying for months, in a nutshell the banks do not care.

Gary Simmons July 2, 2009

I read this article with great interest and how true are your statements. Having been a senior manager with one of the Big 4 for 26 years and a broker for the last 15 years I have seen many changes in the finance world.
In some respects you give me hope and have reinforced in my mind that my business partner & I made the right decision several years ago to diversify. Our firm originally was simply a Mortgage Manager for residential loans only.

With my background as a corporate finance manager,we established a corporate finance broking division which services every type of business finance there is.

I agree most strongly with your comments regarding the stranglehold the Big 4 now have on the finance market and make no mistake, if the Banks could do away with brokers - they would. Problem as I see it is the Banks set such far reaching targets for their BDM’s to achieve, and as a BDM it is virtually impossible to meet those targets unless you foster a credible referral source. That is where I have found what might be a “kink” in their armour.

We are constantly being “courted” by BDM’s from all banks and in one instance, we set a cup of coffee down every Monday morning for our usual visit by one of the Big 4 BDM’s.

You have also validated a belief I had years ago that it is not only Banks that lend money. There are still out there well established and reliable non Bank lenders who whilst have taken a pounding over the last 12 months, I find they are more flexible and willing to listen - plus also are willing to tailor a deal to include a reasonable return for our professional services. Pricing is dearer but I have found with many of our business clients, pricing is not always the priority - it is getting the deal done.

I also strongly agree on educating brokers and requiring a licensing process that is industry recognised and not something “out of a weaties packet”. The Bank probably spent more than it should on educating me but I still carry that knowledge today.

I am proud of what I do as a corporate finance broker and as such expect the same level of professional respect from not only our clients, but also from the bankers and other lenders I deal with on a daily basis.

Wehn I prepare a proposal and submit it to a lender, I consider it approved because if I was still in the Bank I would have approved it myself.

What is still missing is the genuine willingness of some bankers to work with their broker in structuring a propsal to meet both the Bank’s criteria and the client’s expectations. I know where the “wall” is and that is with the Bank’s credit area - those faceless beings locked away in some isolated chamber and “untouchable”.

I challenge any of the Big 4 to allow their Credit Managers the opportunity to also meet and work with the broker and (dare I say it)meet the client and provide postive and meaninful assistance, rather than this current isolationalist approach to lender assessment.

I continue to hold the belief that things will get better and as brokers we will be viewed as professionals by the banks and not some thing to be tolerated.

Mick July 2, 2009

When will the MFAA, FBAA, and major aggregators start making approaches to ACCC and ASIC over the current third lining practices.
CBA latest would have to be the most arrogant of all with it’s demand on minimum applications and $500 re accreditation fee. What a joke, I learnt far more from my own reseacrh than attending the initial accreditation; anyway walk out the door and the info is obsolete.
NAB Star rating, WBC new requirements for commercial lending, reduction in trail commisiion on all loans if too many clients are refinanced elsewhere, commission rates based on selling other products. I’ve no problems with group volume bonuses, but a bank would be hauled up over the Trade Practices Act if it required a direct client to take out insurance with it as a condition of obtaining a loan. This is exactly what the banks are trying to acheive with some commission schemes with brokers. “No ma’am I think you should take this loan out with CBA because I need to retain my acreditation. No we should’nt move you from this lender as it might affect my trail commission on all the other loans I have. Look you really need to take out a credit card with WBC if I’m to get you business finance. Sorry I can’t place this loan with NAB because my Star rating is down as my custiomesr lately din’t like the Red Star” (boy, that’s what I would expect under a red regime)

Oz Boy July 2, 2009

I think the above is a fair indication of where we are at. I agree with the sentiment that we all need to get together and the MFAA/FBAA etc never will be able to put our proposition forward in a professional manner. Perhaps if the larger aggregators, Aussie and MC got together as one they would have some input moving forward, imagine if they all moved on CBA’s new policy of 3rd line forcing for loan numbers and each of them took CBA off the panel now that would offer some push back and would draw a line in the sand. Yes there is no doubt it would be difficult in the short term but no where near as difficult as it will be for us in the medium or longer term if we don’t start pushing back. If ever mortgage brokers needed their aggregators to step up it is now but we need you all to do it together. Can you imagine the fall out at CBA if they had to dismantle the broker channel?? With the costs put in over the last 6 months, new staff etc someone would have to front the board and explain the loss. Now that is one scenario that I would love to see play out, tell me then that the other lenders wouldn’t strengthen their relationships and if they didn’t then every mortgage broker would know exactly where they sit.

Xerxes July 2, 2009

I know all aggregators have their head in the sand. But you aggreagtors need to cut the first lender who moves one inch further on commission. No negotiation, cut them from all aggregator panels.

Brokers individually are little more than a rabble & have shown an inability to act in a collective fashion for the good of our industry. Thus any lender who moves an inch further on commissions must be removed from all aggregator lending panels or it is game over.

Aggregators are you listening???

It’s line in the sand time or your aggregation businesses are finished.

The ongoing interviews Jill is doing with aggregator bosses show these aggregator CEO’s are either fools or gutless. It’s long past time for them to stand or die.

Xerxes July 2, 2009

To Oz Boy,

Perfect, I aggree with you 100%.

I haven’t really done much business with CBA over the last 2 years. But they are now officially struck off my panel.

However, it is not only individual brokers who need to do this.

Aggregators must make the move. Cut CBA. Their deamnd’s are ultimately anti-competitve and reveal an active sentiment of hostility towards the broker chanel. Aggregators must get together quickly (pick up the phone and talk with each other aggregators), unite for the common good of the industry, & agree on a ‘front foot’ plan of action.

CBA are hostile to brokers. Remove CBA immediately from aggregator lending panels. Take a stand or we die!!!

SMc July 2, 2009

Doesn’t highlight the key point - are YOU making money as a broker? If so, why be concerned with what the banks make, how they discriminate or what might or might not happen. Don’t be the most overqualified, most professional - then make a loss. The panacea to overcome all obstacles is to be MOST CONVENIENT to YOUR CLIENTS.

Broker2 July 2, 2009

Interesting - and I agree entirely that teh ACCC need to be made aware of some things: In fact I’m currently drafting a letter (draft only at this stage mind you, so forgive the fairly simplistic language…), but I’m happy to accept constructive criticism and comments on this:

Open letter to:
• Brokers
• Aggregators
• Australian Competition and Consumer Commission
• Mortgage & Finance Association of Australia
• Senator the Hon Nick Sherry

Competition is one of the truly great things in the Australian banking sector. It provides consumers with choice and ultimately better services and products. This we all know.

As a professional mortgage broker I’m concerned that some of the larger Australian banks seem to be heading down a dangerous path when it comes to competition, and their relationships with mortgage brokers, and I would like to voice my concerns as I see them.

As many of you would be aware, the mortgage broking industry has grown rapidly over the last decade and many, many consumers have reaped the benefits of using a broker (at no personal expense) to assist them in sourcing appropriate property finance.

Having been a broker for almost all of the last decade I have seen the enormous changes first hand, most of which have been positive.

Most professional brokers have been crying out for Regulation in our industry for years, and it looks like we’re finally about to get some, which is fantastic.

Recently however there have been some developments which I feel are disturbing and a hindrance to competition in the mortgage market – particularly for consumers who wish to utilise the professional services of mortgage brokers.

The issue is this:

A couple of the major lenders have recently introduced a minimum volume criteria for individual brokers (not broker groups or aggregators), whereby if a broker does not use a particular lender a certain number of times in a calendar period the broker will be paid less than the standard commission, or restricted from certain products, or have their accreditation with that lender terminated (and a fee charge by the lender to have the accreditation reinstated.).

This flies directly in the face of what a mortgage broker’s role encompasses at it’s most basic level: To assist consumers in sorting through lenders and their products for an appropriate mortgage.

These lenders are holding brokers to ransom by insisting on a certain number of “deals” in order to maintain standard accreditation and payment terms. This is far from being in the best interest of the consumer. Many brokers will feel the pressure to utilise a particular lender simply to “hold on” to their accreditation, or to be paid fairly for their work, and this again, defies the very essence of our role.

My understanding is that aggregators were initially set up so as to overcome any volume requirements by lenders, but lenders seem to be moving on to a new phase, and aggregator involvement is being “pushed to the side” it seems.

The lenders will argue that the reason for these, let’s call them what they are, ‘trade restrictions’ are to ensure that only brokers who are educated in their particular policies and products are putting loans to them, to ensure minimal errors and maximum service levels. They insist that a certain level of expertise and experience with each lender is required, and this is the base reason for their new initiatives.

I disagree strongly with this sentiment.

I, of course, agree strongly that ongoing broker education is paramount, and all professional brokers are already required to meet minimum Continuing Professional Development levels (Refer to MFAA CPD requirements). And many of us, certainly the brokers that I know, continue to educate themselves by attending lender training and continually researching individual lender policy and products as part of their research for customers.

If a broker doesn’t use a particular lender very often it may be for any of the following reasons, and more:
• Another loan may have a more competitive interest rate which is more appealing to the consumer
• Another lender may have a comparable product but with more suitable features for the consumer’s needs
• A consumer may have particular needs which do not fit a certain number of lenders
• Turnaround times on loan approval, and service levels (pre and post settlement) may be of concern to a consumer

Let’s look at an example:

Homeside Lending is a lender who has recently introduced a “Star Rating” system for brokers.

You get a certain number of Stars, based on a number of things (some fine and education based, like obtaining Certificate IV in Mortgage Broking), but the Fourth Star is dependent on the number of deals submitted to the bank.

If you don’t provide a certain number of deals, you don’t get your 4th Star.

No 4th Star means that you can’t access 95% lending, which means that brokers are forced to turn customers away if that’s the product a customer requires.

Interestingly in my number of years broking there have been quite rarely times when I have been compelled to utilise Homeside’s services. Generally, there are products that are more competitive, and I have found that customer feedback on their “after sales service” is poor.

Further, of late, Homeside’s turnaround times on loan approvals has been shockingly below par, and placing a loan to Homeside, when not absolutely imperative, would be doing a consumer a distinct disservice, so I have not.

Given that I have not utilised Homeside recently I am now only a 3 Star broker which means that I cannot introduce customers who require 95% lending to them. This distinctly restricts my ability to trade in the current environment where many lenders have been forced to back away from 95% lending due to the ‘Credit Crunch’.

Homeside are “profiteering” from the lack of options available at 95% lending, and holding the product up to the highest bidder.

Make access to the product all about the quality of the customer by all means, but the number of loans a broker introduces to you should not impact policy.

Now, if Homeside offered products that were better priced, and offered service that was attractive to brokers, and also to consumers after settlement (which in my opinion they do not) then they wouldn’t have to impose these regulations – they would be getting quality applications from solid applicants, assisted by professional brokers.

Ultimately, shouldn’t it be about the service provider ‘earning’ the business, rather than using ‘force or punishment’ measures ?

But let’s not dwell on Homeside as they’re not the only culprit. CBA have also introduced a minimum volume requirement. What are Aggregators for then ?

The truly scary thing is that if CBA and NAB Homeside “get away with it” then other lenders will follow and we will be left with brokers keeping spreadsheets on who’s “turn” it is to get the next loan, just to try to keep their business going. Either that, or each broker will only have 4 or 5 accreditations each. That scenario, simply put, will be the death of competition in Australian banking.

It cannot be allowed to happen.

CBA are also guilty of holding brokers responsible for things outside of their control, such as the loan offer documents not being signed correctly. (This is more accurately the responsibility of the borrower and their legal representative.) Nor is it under the control of the broker to ensure that each of their customers doesn’t fall into arrears on their repayments. Nor can brokers force a customer to go ahead with a loan if the customer changes their mind or the purchase of a property falls through. Yet CBA feel it’s appropriate to pay brokers less, based on these “conversion” and “error” issues.

I will happily take responsibility for any errors I make in my professional dealings with lenders and customers, and cop a reduce commission if I don’t perform, but I cannot accept that it is fair practice for lenders to reduce my income based on circumstance beyond my control.

Service from lenders is at an all time low and yet the larger lenders are using their power to slowly squeeze brokers and force them to utilise them, and them alone.

This is a direct hit at competition and must be stopped before we end up a “4 Big Bank Nation.” That would be an unmitigated disaster.

Regulation of the broking industry needs to consider protection for brokers as well as placing rules around their trade. There is no doubt that brokers have been a big hit with consumers, and have done much to promote competition in this industry, but we need more help from regulation to ensure brokers keep on being able to be brokers.

Thank You.

SMc July 2, 2009

Geez Broker2, give us a break & short opinions, not sermons. Hands up who actually read that?

Bill July 2, 2009

The pot is stirring today. Too much reading, gotta get back to work and give my clients the service they deserve. Hope to be here in 12 months!!!

JC July 2, 2009

If you read the first bit SMc, you might have read it for what it was; a drafted letter that Broker2 was already planning on sending out to various groups.
No-one’s forcing you to read anything :)
At least Broker2 has an opinion - what might yours be?

Ken Bruns Loanplanners July 2, 2009

While our anonymous contributor has not stated anything radically new, he has surmised the situation exceptionally well. Seeing it surmised so succinctly has been a wake up for me and has is perhaps a catalyst for action.
I don’t believe that banks will one day simply announce that they will no longer accept applications form brokers. They will be more subtle than that and when you think about it-they really have already started.
I am not talking about the people that we deal with at the Banks. The BDM’s the State managers etc. they are for the vast majority caring and good people who, if the broker channels withered would be at as much of a loss as we would.
At the very top though, the wheels are already in motion.
Higher LVR’s are already more available through branches, shorter service times are too. It’s the same with choice of loans, some banks have already started to make more loan types available to clients directly than via brokers.
It is however because of the nature of our businesses and the fact that there are so many of us, all with our own independent structure and “I’ll look after myself attitudes” we may not ever capitalise on the one asset that we de indisputably have.
Our Business!
We could (and should) mount a campaign whereby we only place business with lenders that do not seek to undermine the greatest public asset in the Australian mortgage market ……..competition.
There are numerous examples of some members of the big four taking action that will ultimately result in diminished competition.
For example, recently the CBA has decided that if their products aren’t competitive and a broker reflects that by not using them for a time, that broker must then pay $500 for the privilege of being able to offer more CBA loans of questionable value.
Another example is the Westpac approach to commissions. Mortgage brokers are the single biggest contributor to exploiting whatever competition there is in Australia between lenders, and Westpac’s lead in trying to diminish that channel by unilaterally cutting commissions is anti-competition.
We would have a sympathetic view of those cuts if in fact the story that they pedalled at the time was true, namely that they were struggling for margin and profitability. It has however since then become patently obvious that that is pure and simple rubbish. Banks are making much better margins now than at any other time in the past ten years, the only difference is that right now they can increase both margin AND market share….a great double!
It is no coincidence that both Westpac and the CBA are the two biggest banks in the country. They are both having a very good ‘recession’ and getting fat off the combination of extra margin extra market and extra parsimony.
Will some person in a position of leadership in the industry not take up the cudgels and organise a movement that could ultimately amend the trend before it reaches tipping point?

Greg July 2, 2009

Wow. Just got back from an appointment and haven’t you all been busy.

The prospect asked why I didn’t use the major banks. I said they are too slow, too lazy, too greedy, they don’t pay and they make up the rules as they go along, just to suit themselves.

She said “Great, finally I have a broker that thinks like I do”

Writer July 2, 2009

Since you ask, it appears before Broker2’s/JC’s, but I understand how you could have missed it.

Xerxes July 2, 2009

Broker 2,

I read you post. Yes it was a little long for this site, but can I encourage you to send this off to the ACCC, MFAA & Senator Sherry.

Very well put. Perhaps you could do some reductions. But your points are well made.

BBB July 2, 2009

What a great wake up article .
Let’s face it the NAB are not broker focused let Home side do it !!
So there is the one that really does not want brokers , it was NEVER serious in its own right.

The best advice fron our anomyous friend is the as brokers use our strenght , force our aggregators to be more radical and TOUGH with the banks ( Note please CEO’s and General Managers) .
The second GEM IS TO DEAL AS MUCH AS WE CAN WITH THE LENDERS OUT SIDE THE BIG 4 , do not follow your habitual patterns and deal with the CBA / west pac ect ., Loss 0f market share will hurt them and will happen if we take a stand .

Secondly start to pressure the FBAA/ MFAA to be prepared to go to The ACCC & ASIC about the predatory behaviour and practices of the big 4 , it is non competative behaviour if they approve a deal in 3 days for a branch customer and 10 days for a broker deal , it will take just ONE test case to fix this behaviour .

Last but not least BECOME professional , and service your clients in tyhe best & most professional way you can . They really do not to deal with the big 4 THEY WANT A PERSONALISED SERVICE five it to them .

Paul Flakus July 2, 2009

Fristly to broker 2. Please note that Hon Nick Sherry is no longer the contact point. It is now Hon Chris Bowen.

Secondly, I could not agree more with Gary Simmons comments. I too ,spent many years in the Commercial Banking arena of a major 4, whereby I had a credit authority for all aspects of lending and was very pleased with my years in their employment. Good fortune enabled me to move to Melbourne and use my valuable banking experience to establish a commercial finance broking business some 15 years ago.Over that time I have seen how lenders/BDm’s wine and dine us finance brokers for business. I have always advised the lender/BDM that I work for the client ( who have remained loyal to me for past 15years plus they give me repeat buiness plus refer new clients ) and not the lender. I my view the lenders are our business partners .

I have a majority of commercial BDM’s call on me regularly for a catch up and they keep me in the loop of policy, etc etc.

We as professional finance brokers, need to further publicise the borrower/ our client, the lender and our Aggregator of how professional we are.

In my opinion,the challenge going forward for finance brokers will be , what will the Aggregators do to combat the culling of finance brokers ( given the fact , that Westpac is also on the culling process for commercial brokers). They need us.

Also, finance brokers need an Industry body, that looks after the finance broker and is not governed by lenders, aggregators. hence the finance broker has a say how their industry is governed and represents the finance broker.

The AIPB (www.apib.com.au) addresses this issue and has even had positive feed back from Govt bodies as to how Finance Brokers should be licensed into various categories .

Lastly,I believe that in these tough times the well olied finance broker with good customer relationships, and proficinet in all areas of finance broking will survive . The Finance Broker is highly regarded as a Professional .

Cartel July 2, 2009

The insider is exactly correct.

The Broker industry originated as the sales force for the NBFIs The huge growth in this market forced the banks (against their wishes) to also use brokers.

Now the NBFI’s are gone. Or at least, temporarily shut down waiting for the securitised market to return as it eventually will - hopeflly in the short term.

The banks know that NBFIs will come back but they can’t, without a sales force. Wipe out the brokers and your kill the NBFIs and you kill your competition.

The only thing that scares the hell out of the banks is REGULATION.

And the only word that scares the banks is CARTEL.

The banks don’t want competition and they want to spread propaganda that there is competition - to avoid regulation.

There is only one thing the brokers can do to stop the banks and that is to write to the press and polititans, talk to customers, collegues and friends and tell them the truth - that there is no competition.

We all know that no competition means higher interest/fees and poor service for customers.

The Gov’t with its guarantee may have saved the big banks but they have created a cartel which has destroyed the finance industry.

KeyChange July 2, 2009

I’d really like to see a response from Ray Hair or any of the aggregator CEO’s - where are you guys…..polishing your fiddles, while CBA collects the kindling?

Greg July 2, 2009

Key Change

Heh, Heh, Heh, Heh …….

Why do you think Ray and his cronies sold out to Challenger and big John bent over for the CBA. They saw it coming and some time over the next six months we will all wake up. I only hope we haven’t left our run too late.

Savvy Investor July 2, 2009

Hi Cartel,

You beat me to the Send Key…

Have to disagree that the banks are out to kill the broker channel. As I have pointed out time and time again we are a cheap overflow mechanism for them and it serves little purpose to remove us. Giving them ideas on how to punish us further is not in anyones interest either so lets keep it positive, rather than speculating on what they can do in the future e.t.c. They are there to make money and no one is disputing their right to do so. It is when their methods reduce competition and are directly against our clients best interests that I draw the line.

Let us all remember that the real power in this game is not held by brokers or even the Banks, but by the government that allows Banks to operate and defines the rules under which they can, and the population of Australia (our clients) who funds via deposit and loans, these institutions depend on for their survival. It is they who force changes in policy and the majority of them have no idea of what is happening in the industry nor the potential effect this may have on their future Banking costs and options. Until there is better understanding by the public of these issues (someone takes the time and cost to educate and inform them) then there is no reason for things to change. Then and only then will options to fix the problems be taken seriously. The government purports to exist to protect and serve the population and their popularity is based on the degree to which they are perceived to be doing this. They have a stated interest in preserving the competition in Banking for the good of their constituents.

The government has taken steps to regulate the broking industry to eliminate predatory lending practices but no one has taken the time to re-assess the regulation of the Banking industry as the perceived lack of fallout of the GFC in Australia seems to indicate we don’t need reforms. If reforms are to occur then this would have to be through actions taken by the government (through pressure of popular opinion). Know an influential member of the public/government? Let them know what is happening and ask them to tell everyone else. Don’t keep us a secret and help spread word of benefits for consumers of a healthy broking industry at the same time (Win- Win)…

Consider This July 2, 2009

Did you know that banks LOVE brokers telling other brokers not to use banks - and all of the above talk? It’s called divide & conquer, because it polarises us into manageable parcels instead of when we collectively wrote business volumes they couldn’t ignore. Instead of imploding nicely for them, just write more deals, we can do it.

Troy July 2, 2009

Folks you just don’t get it do you, especially those what protest loudest. Our industry has far too many brokers in it now. MFAA says it has 13,000 members then there is the FBAA and the AIPB and then those that operate without being members of an association. Add to this branch lending officers of banks, credit unions and other lending institutions and then there are the mobile lending officers.
We do not need this many so if you are not serious about broking and by this I mean writing more than just one or two loans a month then stop your whinging and get out.
Whilst I agree with a lot of what our anonymous writer has to say I sense in this thread and many others I have read recently that there are a lot of good brokers frustrated with the whingers and whiners. I say it again to you whingers and whiners if you don’t like what your getting then get out and leave it for those who enjoy broking and this industry to get on with it.
I have been working in the mortgage industry for 30 years come this October and have been broking for 12 years and have seen many changes both good and bad. I enjoy coming to work and I do not gripe about lenders service turnaround times, commission cuts or policy changes.
What I am getting sick and tired of is the pathetic comments like Mr Aggregator stop dealing with CBA, Westpac, NAB and ANZ, why don’t you big banks treat brokers better, Mr North you are a broker basher and so on.
I look forward to broker numbers being reduced. Bring it on !!

Paul G July 2, 2009

Stop Blaming CBA or the other Major lenders
Stop Blaming Aggregators
Stop thinking cutting lenders is a solution.

A large portion (just check the stats) of Broker groups, Brokers and Franchises continue to send 90% of there business to majors that are the ones at fault, no one else.

Wake up Principles and wake up Lazy Brokers…

I have been a big supporter of lenders like ING for years and 90% of my business goes that way, not the other way round.

Support lenders that need brokers. “Its not rocket science”

Xerxes July 2, 2009

It’s not hard to pick a true brokers comments from an imposter.

To anyone posing as a broker on this site, do you really think you are kidding us.

Louis July 2, 2009

Message to Troy.

You quote:

“I enjoy coming to work and I do not gripe about lenders service turnaround times, commission cuts or policy changes”

If the above don’t bother you,of course you enjoy coming to work - because you do nothing all day!In fact, there’s no way you are a broker if you make those comments.

If St George quote 2 days turnaround for a decision for Gold brokers and then take 4 days. There’s a problem….and a further week for formal approval after valuations are received. There’s a problem.

Clients find a home and are given 5 - 10 days cooling of periods. How can we get an unconditional approval in this time.

I too like coming to work but I have a gripe on bank service. If you advertise 2 days for a decision why is it taking 4.

Go and sip on your Pina Colada!

Derek Miles July 2, 2009

YEP - COULDN’T AGREE MORE.

In my view, there is no reason to think that you can only get finance for a client through one of the four majors. Most of the alternatives such as ING, AMP, Homeloans Ltd and others offer comparable products with competitive rates and competitive features. It takes time to learn the offereings from these lenders, but well worth the trouble - much better service levels and loans will approve and settle on time.

So, like any business, you must spread your risk. You have to ask your client - do they need to get their loan from a major? - why on earth would they want to line up in branch ques? - if they go to the branches of the major lenders, will they get the right loan or just the one that makes the most profit for the bank? and so on.

Brokers need to be truly professional in their business, not just salespersons who will only sell the cheapest product just to get a sale - in reality, the salesperson mentality is no worse than a bank officer who sells the loan that makes the most profit for the bank or a financial planner who flogs product with the highest commission.

I have been in the business for 15 years and I have a core client base and the only reason I have this is that I offer a service that provides clients with the best loan and lender regardless of rate.

Consider This July 2, 2009

I agree with Troy, good points. Louis & Xerxes, would lenders feel a need or the passion to submit a view, let alone under the guise as a broker? Take a breath. Regards broker no. 3079, registered 1992.

Xerxes July 2, 2009

As I said, easy to pick the imposters.

Not an Imposter July 2, 2009

Way to go Troy! I like reading these posts for entertainment value only. I am not an imposter but a broker who employs a staff of 6 and settles $12-$15M per month. I’ve been in business for 6 years and just love it when the could of’s and should of’s start whinging when things get tough. I commend the banks for making it tough on the brokers that have been writing a miserable couple of loans a month year after year. Happy to see new hurdles and give me quicker turnaround times in the process. Tell me Consider this & Xerxes just how small are your businesses? Here’s a clue……get back to work!

Michael July 2, 2009

As a broker, I have often felt that I have a conflict of interest insofar as I work my butt off for the borrower, and yet I am paid by the lender.

In the past, when there was a greater range of lenders, it would be easy for some brokers to recommend a lender that pays a higher commission. Not my style, but I know it was done.

Perhaps there should be NO commissions paid by the Lenders, but they could be directed to pay the agreed brokers fee at settlement. If rates were stripped down to the minimum, there may also be an agreed trail fee.
In this way the borrower is more directly involved in deciding how much the broker is worth.

There would still be a role for the Aggregator, who would receive and dispense the fees whilst taking a percentage in return for IT platforms and educational support.

Competitors of the Big 4 should be able to get their rates down so that Brokers would recommend them, whilst the Big 4 might struggle with the weight of their infrastructure.

Of course it would help competition if some of the Lenders did not enjoy a Government Guarantee.

Now, before anyone suggests that I am a Bank stooge, let me assure you that I am a small broker who has been struck off CBAs list of accredited brokers. One reason given was that due to the lack of business I could not have a good knowledge of their policies.

Just prior to being struck off without any prior discussion I was considering CBA in the mix for a loan for a particular couple.
Some of the income from one borrower related to a post graduate scholarship.

Having looked through the policy manual, I could not find any reference to it, so sent an email to a BDM. The BDM was not available, so I sent the email to the general broker support area. Following that, another BDM responded on behalf of the unavailable BDM.

In the finish I received two responses:

1. We generally accept scholarship income, but please provide us with more details.

2. We generally DO NOT accept scholarship income, but please provide us with more details.

So much for my poor understanding of CBA policies!!!

Most of you will be pleased to know that the loan went to a Building Society who happened to have the most competitive product at the time.
Sorry CBA, I cannot give you $500 for re accreditation, nor can I give you 12 deals per year!

Consider This July 2, 2009

Psst, I’m WITH Troy.

Maria Rigoni July 2, 2009

Finance Brokers have the ability to reshape their profession to where they want it be be, they can dictate to the market how they want their profession to be seen and how they want to be treated. They can achieve this by owning their profession and becoming an active member of the Australian Institute of Professional Brokers (AIPB). The only true 100% Finance Broker governed industry representative body. http://www.aipb.com.au

I invite all to do what the anonymous senior industry commentator suggests - we have created the vehicle - the AIPB - band together to build broker market power - join - forget about whether aggregators or lenders recognize the AIPB as a broker representative body for accreditation purposes - why should they recognize a industry body that focuses on the broker - my analyse of the situation says that they think that by not recognizing the AIPB it will disappear.

By joining the AIPB in spite of “no recognition” by lenders or aggregators brokers are making a statement that they care about and respect themselves and seriously own their profession.

I invite the anonymous senior industry commentator to contact me at maria.rigoni@aipb.com.au if your agenda is honorable.

We concentrate on what we have experienced, our experiences become our truth, new knowledge with experience creates new truths.

FEAR is created through future expectations appearing real.

People representing Banks are frightened about what the the future holds
People representing Aggregators are frightened about their future
Brokers generally are frightened about what the future holds

One can never know what has never been - there is no absolute truth - so there is nothing to FEAR.

Positive action and improvement comes from looking reality in the eye and making decisions based on possibilities rather than on expectations.

Current realities as I see them include:

1) Banks are in business to make as much profit for themselves as possible - this is not a crime they are a legal entity and their policies are made by individuals who are paid a lot of money to be ruthless in the market place to achieve objectives while overtly operating within the law of the land.

2) Banks like any business have a legal right to deal with or not to deal with any individual or business they choose to.

3) Banks are currently shaping the Finance Broking Profession via manipulation of brokers using aggregators and MFAA and FBAA - the banks are positioning brokers to be where they want the profession to be to suit their own agenda, gratifications and profits.

4) Banks have market power and this is a legal and legitimate power to hold - if banks misuse their power to take unfair advantage then their conduct is supposedly against the law however as Australia has four major banks it is nigh on impossible for individual brokers to prove that cutting individual accreditations will substantially lessen competition for borrowers seeking credit products - I anticipate the regulators will take the view that all the banks are doing is vertically integrating their business distribution channels in line with their strategy plans.

5) A bank is a retailer of credit products and any retailer is free to set the terms and conditions of distribution agreements. The terms and conditions do not have to be fair.

6) Brokers are in competition with banks for borrowers and a good strategic tactic for a bank is to support finance brokers who favour their products and systems - the more business a broker gives to an individual lender the less they will be able to give to other lenders and eventually accreditations with the other lenders will be cancelled and the banks will then be able to make redundant their mobile lending staff as technically they will have replaced them with brokers with no alternative but to use them on bank set terms and conditions.

7) Finance Brokers have been covertly trained to think they are reliant on lenders to stay in business - this a a myth

8) There is nothing more that the banks want to see than the borrower paying for the broker to do what they currently do for the bank and the borrower as this would mean that the banks get what they want without paying for it - the introduction of customers and the completed outsourced lending tasks handed to them on a fee free platter - this is another good strategy to reduce costs and boost profits - and there will be no need for clawback as they will not be paying anything to the broker in the first place.

Many things thought to be impossible have been proven to be possible.

Gordo July 2, 2009

Fellow brokers, we are all bashing our heads and whining about the current state of affairs and how we are being manipulated by the majors. With commission reductions, accreditation targets and retraining costs etc from CBA and WBC for starters, we know without opposition that most of the other lenders will follow suit!

We keep on saying that the MFAA or FBAA should stand up and our aggregators should oppose the banks. I say we should follow the former catch cry of the Democrats and “keep the bastards honest” the banks that is. Here in WA we have always acted with full transparency and our customers interests at heart. I believe every broker on this continent should now do the same.

To this end, please do the following where possible:
Prepare a new addendum to add to your Finance Broker Contract. After listing your panel lenders and the commission that you receive and how you share it with your aggregators’ and staff. List all the lenders with accreditation targets, re-accreditation costs and training fees.
Then we can truly educate the consumers as to the tactics of the big banks.

I have had clients, where all the lenders (that the client was interested in) and whose products were on par, chose the one that paid me a higher commission. If we act with honesty and integrity (unlike the major 4) we will reap the rewards.

Tell your clients that in principle you would like to fire the major 4 banks from your panel because they are pushing brokers to write business with them or face re-accreditation challenges, reduced LVR’s and added costs, only so you the broker will be able to offer them that bank’s lending options. You personally don’t want to support lenders with these bullying tactics as you don’t want to appear as being swayed when making a recommendation, which in the end should be in the client’s best interest! (let them know this).

If we all take some kind of similar approach and educate the consumers then word will spread. I say let’s Push forward with FULL DISCLOSURE! And keep the bastards honest.

Xerxes July 3, 2009

As a tip on how not to appear as an imposter.

Simply pick a pseudonym. Stick to it. & only post under it. Its not that hard.

A pseudonym that appears out of the blue, in one posting (expresses strange ideas that to the average broker seems counterproductive to the entire broking industry) & then is never seen again, screams imposter.

Troy July 3, 2009

Hi me again,
No I am not an imposter but as stated a broker of 12 years standing. Just seen my seventh client for the week and have one more to see today. That is activity and that is full time broking.
As crazy as it seems even Maria Rigoni the new shining light for brokers doesn’t seem to get it.
There are too many brokers and there are too many part timers not really doing broking but saying they are.
The lenders do hold the purse strings and consequently make the rules.
My clients come to me and I tell them what lenders I have on my panel (CBA have never been included), I tell them what I am paid and I ask them if they have any further questions or issues with this. Then we do business.
I have had clients make the choice, which is their right, to go direct to their own lender and get a better deal than what I can offer.
This is a free market and what happens in the real world.
We as the broker don’t own the client, nor does the lender, aggregator or anyone else.
So to those who may think I am an imposter, a bank stooge or whatever I say again if you aren’t happy as a broker then get out and let the real brokers get on with it.

Brad July 3, 2009

Insider’s perspective is spot on-Thank you.
Brokers have to realize they are the ones who are in control with the client, as others have stated. The other lenders such as ING easy to sell to the customer great product, and rate highly with customer satisfaction, higher then the majors. Their are many others out there, get to know them and use them. Newcastle Perm, Homeloans, AFM and Heritage to name but a few. In the next 9 months as this FHOG trails off business activity will trail off, why not make an effort to put all your business to the these other Lenders. If they do not meet the requirements for these lenders, spend some time helping the client to save some money for an extra deposit, and do some calculations on how much this will save them. If you do this you can show them savings of thousands, and the homeloan will be paid off sooner.
Sell them the idea, yes, they can go to the Majors but they the customer will be stitched up for life as some previous comments have stated. You are the person who they have come to for advice, give them that advice in an honest and fearless manner. Make sure it is accurate.
The other point that is made Banks care little for the customer and staff. It always reminds me of my experience with General Motors Holden they also had the same attitude to the customer and their Dealerships.
The result for me, is I would never buy another Holden as long as I live, and many others have the same opinion, and now this huge company is in Chapter 9. Toyota cares about it’s customers and that is where I will stay.
The other thing that Brokers should push for with the new Legislation That Bank employee be qualified if they sell a product to the Public
Volumes needed to be supplied to a Bank to retain accreditation should be illegal.
It will be interesting to See if Rudds Ministers are prepared to stand up to the Banks with this new legislation
The other group I feel sorry for is the Banks staff. You see many wonderful employee’s discarded, when they have given the best years of their life to their employer.
So guys it is you who have the Power, in the next twelve months send as much Business to the others and as lending trails off as it will do and the Banks see all this Business not going their way.
What do you think they will do?

Maria Rigoni July 3, 2009

Hello Troy

There are many quality full time brokers and there are many quality part time brokers working in our industry at the present time. I see no valid reason why a professional has to work full time to produce quality outputs.

It is healthy environment for borrowers to have competition between brokers as well as competition between lenders. Competition between brokers will weed out the inefficient / poor quality performers culling via volume targets will not.

Broker in the 'burbs July 3, 2009

Hi Troy,

I follow what you say and I would think that most career brokers would be of the same opinion, i.e. cull the herd of substandard brokers and let the professionals get on with it;

but, don’t get lost in your rhetoric that a good broker is exclusively one that writes significant business.

A broker who writes truckloads can also be a compliance nightmare, credit policy illiterate and often, just a bit like the Dodgy brothers.

Many brokers (including me) operate within different business models, that don’t rely on a low margin volume game, but more on ‘owned’ initial margins, ongoing revenues and implementing all finanz strategies.

You might pride yourself on the wonderous levels of business you write (and good for you), but there are many solid brokers who choose to work the market differently to you. That doesn’t mean they should trot off matey or are substandard.

The measure of a good broker is about skill, professionalism and honesty; not how many app’s you throw in the tray in any given month.

(And the number of high pressure salespeople who have sold large volumes of mortgages and have eventually been collared for all manner of non compliant behaviours is legion)

Broker in the 'burbs July 3, 2009

Hi Maria,

Recently I went onto the website of the AIPB and the objectives look great, however I assume once your membership has reached some level of critical mass, what exactly will the AIPB do?

Not conceptually mind you. In reality.

I mean, without sounding cynical about this, the FBAA have been spruiking the same message (voice of the broker) for years now, but it’s recent record on actively & successfully dealing with the genuine broker issues in the industry is about zip.

So, what ‘firm’ stratgies has the AIPB articulated in their advocacy role?

Part time July 3, 2009

Well put Broker in the Burbs, for I am one of those part time brokers, and I do not need someone like Troy telling me to get out of the industry. I fully agree with the fact that there are many “Brokers” out there that write truckloads, I also know some of them create the most problems. You do not need to be a “truckload” writer to be a successful/professional broker. If I want to write one or two loans a month then that is my business, and Troy no I won’t get out of the business. 13,000 members is alot I agree, but whose fault is this?

DJT July 3, 2009

Troy is falling for the old “what I do is the best and only way” to operate their business syndrome which doesn’t get us anywhere.
Broking is a broad church (and by the way Troy I have 40 years in the industry and 15 in Broking on both sides of the fence if any of that is proof of bona fides).
All models can be accommodated - full time. part time, with/without support staff, from home, in shop, with other broker partnerships.
What cannot and should not ever be accepted are sub-standard brokers and here I agree with Troy. But where do we get sub-standard brokers from. Why through aggregators of course, the selling of franchises and through brokers who have desks to fill at their office and of course the straight out crooks.
I could and maybe should feel resentment towards those ex somethings who have come into my industry looking for the big bucks and stuff it up for all of us through their incompetence. Instead I save my anger for those that facilitate their entry and prop them up, not the brokers themselves.
Most of us run our own small business, write the amount and type of business that is appropriate to our circumstances and do a good job(if we didn’t we would be out of business very quickly).
So lets not try and win a point by chopping up our peers but ALL OF US try and sort out and fix the worst excesses of the Broker Channel. We do need to act together or face our kids talking about “remember when they had Brokers” like we now talk about “remember when the Bank Manager was a respected member of the community”

Broker in the 'burbs July 3, 2009

Spot on DJT.

Aggregators remind me of the old Life Insurance Sales Agency ‘mutuals’ that hired 20 or so ‘virgin’ life insurance salesmen every couple of months or so, who then invariably signed up their respective family members & friends on some expensive life insurance policies… & on commission only terms of course.

After about one year of marginal assistance & ongoing training, maybe one consultant was left who actually cut the mustard and the rest simply dropped off.

Not their policies though. Oh no…they became ‘orphans’ to stay with the Sales Agency. Nice little earners too.

The aggregator model is much the same. (Not all, but a lot) Lender BDM’s are always complaining about the calibre of inductees and the lack of any genuine training by aggregators to fill this skill void.

I think licencing might go some way to fix this problem. At least I hope so.

Xerxes July 3, 2009

Broker in the burbs,

Your comments are sensible as usual.

I was thinking about broker licencing & like you, hope this will help improve some aspects of the mortgage broking industry. However when I look at other industries I have my doubts whether licencing will weed out the unprofessional operators.

Take the real estate industry. They have been licenced for years. But lets face it, there really are some shonks & crooks operating under government issued real estate licences.

I fear mortgage broker licencing will simply add an additional burden of bureaucracy, extra red tape, extra costs (thousands of $$), with no discernable benefit to either customers or the wider broker industry. It’s difficult to legislate for decency & professionalism. Let’s hope I’m wrong.

PJ July 3, 2009

Brokers
Remember when Aussie John first entered the market place in the early 90s and bashed the crap out of the banks! Remember the TV ad where all the footy supporters in the crowd were yelling for their team - Steelers, Raiders, Crushers and then big Johnie comes on and says
“So what do you think of the banks?”

SHAAAARRKS!!!

It was my favourite ad on TV - It was also a great time in the indusrty as we had a clear, distinct competition and a point of difference that everybody understood. It was Bank Vs Non Bank - Us Vs Them,
Competition was ALIVE! - and EVERYBODY BENEFITTED

The banks knew this could have a huge impact on their market share and started carefully planning their fight back all those years ago. The minute that line in the sand started to be erased was the minute the banks knew they would eventually win the war. The big non bank players back then decided to join them rather than fight and keep competition alive - hence the bank bashing TV ads were finished and the majority of brokers over the coming years would not in fact be brokers at all - rather order takers for the major banks.

At present the banks have all the power, than can jack rates up when they feel like it, charge us fees upon fees to their hearts content. We all know this. Kevin Rudd PM and Swannie can jump up and down all they like, all the big 4 will do is smile and keep on doing what they do best - make billions at the expense of every Australian.

Now I know that recent world events and financial markets have certainly not made it easy for the non bank sector - but I beleive that the only way for us to survive long term and take away the power from the big boys is to break away all over again!

Bring back the Us Vs Them! Call them SHAAAARRRKKKS Again!!

Now if you want to write loans for the banks go and get a job at Westpac - you’ll be sure to get one of those great looking cars to buzz around in

FOR THE REST OF YOU LETS BRING BACK COMPETITION!

Kevin July 4, 2009

Are the big 4 taking advantage of the current economic conditions to reduce costs and kill off some competitors? Of course they are. As a shareholder, I’d be disappointed if they didn’t. Are they doing so to drive brokers out of business? I believe that’s a big NO.

Brokers allow the banks a second bite of the cherry. Clients who choose a broker can still end up with their products. In other parts of the world, brokers write The broker channel will never disappear.

What is starting to happen, and long overdue in my book, is the move to reduce costs by making the industry more efficient and professional. The life agent’s analogy is very appropriate. If you were breathing, you could sell. You now need formal qualifications and need to meet a strict compliance regime to sell life cover now. We are seeing the same with broking.

The industry has to change with the times. The key to survival is to recognise the future and make the changes before they are forced onto you. That way you can change when convenient to you. We lodge as much as possible via computer. Both my brokers have Cert 4 and are currently studying for their diploma. We are paying for Loan writers and processing staff to get their Cert 4.

It’s been an eventful first 2 years in broking. Despite the commission cuts, policy changes and poor service levels, I am confident that there is a bright future for a professional mortgage broking service.

Xerxes July 6, 2009

Hi Kevin, interesting thoughts. I can’t say I agree and find your comments a little strange.

“What is starting to happen, and long overdue in my book, is the move to reduce costs by making the industry more efficient and professional.”

“Reduce costs”, by this I assume you mean commission reductions? Why would a broker think this was long overdue or a good thing?

I aggree reducing costs in running your broking business is a good thing (as long as those cost reductions are not reducing quality of service or downsizing your business). Basically reduce waste. Surely you don’t think licencing will reduce waste do you?

How could licencing reduce costs and make us more effecient? Licencing will add thousands of dollars annually to the cost of operating a broking business plus the costs and time associated with completing courses & fulfilling compliance requirements. I guarantee you, licencing will make brokers less effecient (time spent on compliance issues) & add to costs.

I have got my Cert IV. I can also tell you getting this Cert IV did nothing to improve my professionalism or increase my effeciency or improve my service to my customers. Quite the contrary, it made my business less effecient (many hours spent completing this course) during which time I was less able to focus on my customers plus it added to my costs. All without one wink of benefit to my service or my customers.

Licencing will not improve your business. If you are a good operator before you get your licence you will continue to be a good operator (just with an extra bill in time and dollars completing compliance requirements). If you are a bad operator before licencing you will continue to be a bad operator after licencing.

A July 6, 2009

Very interesting reading and some great ideas. I firmly believe we would succeed if we all band together. I was a commercial lender with one of the majors for 20 years and have been in broking for only 2 years. I have to admit I am finding it tough but I’m not ready to give up yet!

Rob July 6, 2009

100% agree……ALL BROKERS BE AWARE…..ANZ and NAB actively sign up Accountants, Estate Agents and Solicitors onto “SPOT AND REFER” agreements paying 0.3% (ANZ) and 0.4% (NAB) spotters fees merely for a name and phone number. If your network of referrers have “gone cold”, it may be that they are getting “KICKBACKS” direct from ANZ and NAB. I recently became aware that an accounting firm that I referred my clients to recently got paid $8,000-00 for a mere name and telephone number. Maybe as an industry we need to band together to highlight for all who NOT TO REFER YOUR CLIENTS TO. Be careful……be very very careful who you refer your clients to…….the major Banks are weeding their way into every other sector of the market.

PC July 6, 2009

Rob, are you Eastern States Based or WA?
Very interesting to know this, if these 2 are infact doing this then we can be sure the others will follow, however this has always been the case with the Mobile lenders anyway so not sure what impact it will have. Having said that the almighty Dollar is a big carrot.

Louis July 6, 2009

What Rob has said is true. It happened to me.

We built a strong relationship with an accountant firm and were giving the business to our NAB BDM. All of a sudden business dried out. We later found out that the NAB BDM was dealing direct with the accountant. The BDM now works for the accountant.

My advice is not to introduce the bank to the accountant. They will find out anyway and do the dirty on you but at least you have a better chance if the introduction isn’t made. We thought we were safe as we had known the BDM for many years and didn’t think he would do this.

A lesson learnt.

That's Business July 6, 2009

Spot & refer has been around for a long time, but inevitably the mobile lender stuffs up or moves on and can’t offer the same range we can. BOQ dropped brokers and signed up franchises & the likes of Storm Financial - and what a fantastic success they have been!! Don’t stretch your referrer base and set up a bit of a network to reward your good referrers back with business. If you can’t then they might do just as we do - seek to get paid for their time & connections.

Lender4Life July 6, 2009

Reading all this above just shows you that we all have to vent our frustrations and really everyone has an opinion.
I would like to cover a few points for my 2 cents.

1: We operate in a free market economy. You have a good idea and operate in the law you will do well. Some of the above comments are going on that they will somehow squeezed out of the industry in a “gotcha moment” and I will explain further below.

2: Banks direct lending is very inefficient and costly. The mortgage teams whinge , can’t cross sell, their targets get changed most quarters, branches poorly refer business and the whole process is not as streamline as someone might make you think. To prove this their is one major brand in the eastern suburbs of Sydney that completed a full 12 mortgages in 12 months from this branch and a leading RE Agent said it was one of the most active markets in the East Suburbs. My experience is that I worked for this bank and my old workmates say to me that things are still the same. That was 10 years ago.

3. Aussie for your info made their name and major hit in the market with 1 product form 95-99 and that was the Mac Bank Puma product. 1 (one) product that had all the hairs in the world. It will only take another 1 product sold to all brokers in the market place for banks to get into a difficult situation again, so don’t discount other lenders coming into the market and using aggregators to distribute their product.

4: Mortgage Brokers with low expenses are like cockroachers , they are hard to kill. ( not ugly or awful) A senior bankie who prices up mortgages said that with all the turmoil in US and UK , most brokers survived the nuclear blast. Costs KILL everything. Yes you can write business through your own bank channel but they are inefficient , don’t believe me try to call one at 5.30PM on a Friday evening. What do you really need a laptop, mobile and a car and printer.

5. Regulation. This topic always makes me laugh. I have a question for you , for those that did the Dip of ML what did you really get apart from a nice framed cert and all those nights in the CBD?…nothing..Yes Ok by “regulating ” we will get rid of more people so there will be more loans for us “smarties” for the record I did the DML and was one of the first to graduate and regulation will do far less than what is being suggested.

6. Franchises and Shopfronts. I recently seen a guy I know who has one on High St , and I did his personal home loan as he didn’t want to put it through his brokers and business. How much do you think he made? After putting his home to buy it , 4 people underneath him , expenses out of control ! 75,000 PA. I said to him why are you here? Oh just in case it booms and it gets me out of the house…..seriously….think about this and ask someone that has one or who has sold one on . I know part timers who make 80K a year.

7. Loan Packaging. Most of you don’t understand it , I have seen it work in the UK and when it finally comes here the person who does this will be a very wealthy person. It works in the UK so well that banks cannot compete with this when a broker has access to this. In the UK the packaging is a big as the broking. In some cases now as they are writing the loan on a computer the packager is commencing the loan behind the scene and running with it. Most bag it , say its a waste of time , someone tried it and did it all wrong but watchout its coming.

Thats my 2 cents I welcome your response but if you think us cockroachers are going away , think again…my money is that we are going to be around for a long time..

Xerxes July 6, 2009

Lender4life,

I like most of your thoughts, though I wouldn’t be so complacent about the majors current strategic strikes against us. We will still be around, but unless we stand and fight we might only be a shadow of our present self.

What do you mean by Loan Packaging? It has many meanings.

Kevin July 6, 2009

Your assumption is wrong Xerxes. There is an inherent cost with every broker that a bank accepts business from. This includes accounting, training, accreditations, BDM support (or lack of) etc. Using arbitrary figures, if a bank can cut the number of brokers they deal with by 25%, yet only have a reduction in business of 5% then removing those brokers will make the bank more profitable and more efficient, without any cuts to commissions.

Isn’t your business much more profitable when you are doing $500k loans, rather than dealing constantly with loans under $100k? The same applies to the bank. It’s more profitable to deal with brokers that use electronic lodgment and deal in larger volumes than dealing with hundreds of smaller players who send in hand-written applications.

Rather than the conspiracy theory in the original article, the banks are trying to make it more attractive for brokers to stop operating as small part-time brokers and focus on building or merging to become broking businesses. I don’t believe that removing the smaller part-time operators and consolidating into higher volume businesses is necessarily a bad thing.

You are correct that licensing will not make the industry more efficient. However, just like the life insurance industry, the mortgage broking industry if full of people doing the right thing that are given a bad name by a small number of operators who don’t. Licensing doesn’t get rid of the shonks, but it does make it a less attractive industry for them to try. Those just out for a quick buck are not going to spend time getting formal qualifications.

Like it or not, the bad practices of the past both here and overseas has made licensing inevitable. It would be more efficient to program it into your business over the next 12 months rather than try to cram it in to the exclusion of new business if it becomes compulsory and the deadline is looming.

The commission cuts will be wound back when the GFC starts to clear and the securitization system returns to normal and the competition from non-bank lenders comes back. Those that continue to grow in these tough times will be in a good position to flourish when the commission rates increase. The licensing and compliance should also make a higher barrier to new entrants, providing those who are still here a platform for continued growth.

12 inch vinyl July 7, 2009

I think you might be optimistic in the extreme if you believe the banks are going to give back the commission they took away as soon as the GFC “clears”. There’s only one way they will pay more than they have to to get business, and that’s if they lose a sizeable, noticeable, “sit up and listen” amount of market share. And let’s face it, here we are on YET ANOTHER forum complaining about major banks, commissions, accreditations, volumes and so on, and in spite of all the chest beating,most brokers will be back writing pro packs tomorrow. In other words, the banks have no reason whatsoever to even entertain an increase to commissions. Who can blame them? The last year has proven only one thing - believing that the average broker was smarter than a stick of bubble gum has been a mistake. If you want the banks to respect you, there IS, HAS BEEN and REMAINS only one way to achieve it, take back some control of this situation and guarantee a future for the industry. We all know what it is. Write fewer major bank loans. Trouble is, the bubble gum is winning the argument! A bunch of talking heads we are- and the banks know it, and love it. I cant believe how dumb most of our industry is. Instead of posting bitch after bitch on here- call a non bank or second tier lender- learn their products. Bugger me, do you need someone to feed you and wipe your backsides too? We are a bunch of idiots. And you think we deserve respect from banks? We cant even write deals that are cheaper and better paying than theirs!!!! Its bloody hilarious to them I’m sure.

Lender4Life July 7, 2009

Loan Packaging is a third party looking after the approval process from cradle to the grave. For example you write a loan and a third party navigates this through the whole process. This allows brokers to fix their costs as they only pay for the loans they do and also the broker is then left with more time to go out and write more business.

As for banks giving back commissions , I wouldn’t discount this entirely. A bank increasing commissions to get more market share is a no brainer. GFC is preventing this at the moment however it boomed for 10 years so we as brokers really can’t complain that much. You will see in the near future the banks increasing comms and once one does it , some others will have to follow. Market share is everything. You cant cross sell a client you don’t have. Some banks wont follow however some of these banks have lame products as it is so brokers will really not be loosing out anyway.

Xerxes July 7, 2009

Kevin,

You seem to be singing from the banks song sheet.

Let me explain why I think you are incorrect.

For example - lets take Homeside. I haven’t written a loan with them in the last 2 years. I haven’t attended a Homeside training session. I haven’t spoken with my Homeside BDM. I don’t even know his/her name.

I’m not costing Homeside one cent. Yet I have several million in Homeside loans on the books which they are making money on.

If for some reason I had a brain explosion and decided to start refering/selling homeside again I would simply jump onto the online lodgement system and load in the new deal and send homeside the supporting documents. It isn’t rocket science.

Banks would be far smarter cutting brokers that send them rubbish (whether they be an individual or part of a large broking company) than simply cutting 40% of their listed brokers who hardly send them anything. A smart business would ask why you are sending them nothing (listen to their customers) & change their practices to gain a share of that business.

As an aside note: I haven’t lodged a deal manually in about 18 months. But did you know the banks cost in receiving a manually lodged loan as opposed to an electronically lodged loan was less than $50 / loan (it takes a $25 / hour data entry employee on average 15 minutes to load a deal)? Even given this, if it turns out to be not profitable to deal with manually lodged loans it is very simple. The bank should simply say we are no longer receiving them (from small companies or large companies).

In relation to loan sizes, I work in an expensive real estate region so most of my loans are very large. But I never sniff at a small loan. I treat a $150K loan customer the same as I do a $1.5Mil customer. You never know who the $150K customer knows or what future lending that customer may need.

You continue to sing from the banks song sheet by saying “the banks are trying to make it more attractive for brokers to stop operating as small part-time brokers and focus on building or merging to become broking businesses. I don’t believe that removing the smaller part-time operators and consolidating into higher volume businesses is necessarily a bad thing.”

To me this doesn’t compute. Consider these 2 scenarios.

1. you have 20 individual brokers who regularly communicate and network & bounce ideas off each other, who lodge deals with various banks.
2. These same 20 individual brokers form a company and continue lodging deals with various banks.

There is no difference (cost savings) with the banks dealing with these 20 brokers. Whether they be joined as one company or as individuals.

Aggregation companies solve virtually all the economies of scale you are implying.

On licencing. It will not solve anything. It will not remove the bad operators any more than it did in the Real estate industry. All licencing does is add red tap and expenditure to the vast majority of broking professionals. It is a myth the shonky operator will leave due to licencing. The ‘those out for a quick buck’ argument is nonsense. there is no ‘quick buck’ to be made in broking. You must spend years building up a network and a knowledge base in order to make any sort of money out of broking. There is no ‘quick buck’ for either the shonk or the professional.

Finally, I like your optimism on commissions.

Greg July 7, 2009

Yes there are more shonks in the financial planning industry sending more customers broke than ever. How did your super perform last year??
Just think about Storm Financial….
Yehh…. Right!!!! Licensing will fix everything…….

Chris Szigeti July 7, 2009

I don’t quite believe that this article was written by necessarily a person out of the Bank or someone from the bank in an endeavour to stimulate what we think as brokers for their own purposes ( ie to get us used to the idea that commissions will fall further ) For those you you who have read my article in the new FBAA E mag would already appreciate that the banks are clearly claiming back market share and although they are our business partners they sure are not acting like it. We in the industry need to remind all lenders that the consumer wants choice, and simply going to one bank does not give them that - the consumer is smarter than that, so this is the reason why good brokers will always do well in what ever state the economy is in ( good or bad ).Yes - education is important and I am certain that all professional brokers are aware of this are are doing it. Also in relation to cross selling I don’t believe that the lenders are particularly good at training the broker in this aspect, and it is one area that needs attention. There has been some comment that brokers should stand behind our industry associations and I agree with that and support the FBAA (www.financebrokers.com.au )in their endeavors and ask that brokers get involved and have your say. I also wish to advise that the FBAA had the only practising broker on the committee for the new legislation. The FBAA is run by Brokers for Brokers - Lets all stick together for the health and wealth of our industry.

JJ July 8, 2009

IMO the days of mortgage brokers is over/finished.

Lender4Life August 10, 2009

Really JJ and clients will walk into a bank and everything will go back to the good old days. If you think a bank has changed its way call a bank based broker or even a mobile one on Friday or Sat morning , then see where competition will bring you back.
THEY cannot compete against brokers…its a fact and they know it.
I know because I have worked the full gambit…it never changes…

Lender4Life August 10, 2009

Sorry I meant bank based mortgage person or mobile banker …hey nice cars…

Alex April 30, 2010

Another failed prediction. I have yet to notice any negatives with being a broker versus a banker. Sure I have to know my guidelines very well and not be very detail oriented in general, but since was that not required of me? Only the most competent of originators will flourish as a broker. Why? More loan options means more guidelines to be aware of. The word on the street is the banker job is the easy way to deal with all of the changes that have transpired this past year.

I know of a processor that is going to go work at a bank because ” if it does not close it is not the end of the world”… that sounds like something a bank would say.

Alex April 30, 2010

” Sure I have to know my guidelines very well and not be very detail oriented in general, but since was that not required of ”

TYPO: I meant to say ‘ Sure I have to know my guidelines very well and BE very detailed oriented in general’

How come we can’t edit our comments after we post?

Lavada Sis July 10, 2010

Useful and excellent things you have here. Keep posting! I am always looking to learn on that subject.

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